How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

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How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 03 May 2010 01:40

This just a random thought question.

You veteran players have all been there. You were a blue helped out a newer player and then got the message "can you help me some more?"

Or i now get random messages from people asking for help i dont even see on the players met screen.

Or get just random questions. I once tried to help a player out through the 5-1 and 5-2. Helped him beat 5-1 and then didnt get it to meet up in 5-2. He later that day sent me "finally beat dirty colossus." Then 30 min later i got "beat all the bosses. Now what do i do."

What in general do the rest of you do?? Do you help? Do you stop to answer questions?? Do you just act like your off line??

Normally i will help.
Sometimes when i get questions however i just tell them to go to Demons souls wiki : )

I think i might start asking for little things when i help people now (ie more then just one level). Like if im doing a mage build an the character i help is not a mage im gonna ask for moonstones (Ill always ask to make sure i get ores the dont plan on using). Or any stones i need in my build. Lol is that wrong?? To ask for stuff like that to new players?? Or should i just help them?

So you new players. If a veteran player helped you beat multiple levels would you feel like giving them a few ores in return is ok?

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Hakujin 03 May 2010 01:48

Not that I'm some hardcore veteran as some other players are, but when I help out as a blue I usually do it fore the fun of seeing someone beat a level when you can tell they probably would've had a hard time solo. I don't usually ask anything of the player. If they do it randomly I'll thank them but unless I met up with someone to specially do a trade of some sort, I don't mind helping for "free."

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Angelonedge 03 May 2010 01:57

Same, I don't ask for anything because I figure if they needed help with such an such they probably don't have much to spare, now how to upgrade properly and possibly are overburdened and don't/can't pick up anything. Alot of new players ask questions about where to drop off things they don't want. How to get something, or comment on my weapons/armor.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

MeMcDee 04 May 2010 19:03

I just appreciate it if someone gives me a good rating. That would be nice.

I figure when I say help or someone else says help then they mean help, not do it all for me.

Last edited on 04 May 2010 19:06 by MeMcDee Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

SnakePT 05 May 2010 02:54

Demon's soul's is a great game. Just buying it shows you are not just a "buy massively popular games because they are popular" guy. Also means you like a challenge.

That alone is enough to make me help almost anyone on demon's soul's (Exception: quitters aka cable yankers).
When i invade someone if we have a good fight, win or lose i send a message complementing their performance.

When i invade a quitter i invade him again and try to show him that death is not bad and he shouldn't quit.

When i invade a "newb" (newbs are new or inexperienced players that are having a hard time, or in this case get killing making many mistakes/having a very weak char) and kill him i try to help him after, sending both advice and if he wants a blue eye stone.

When i get good help from a blue phantom i offer my help to him and if he accepts i suicide and join him.

I think its up to you what you do but i like to help other and make the game more competitive.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 03 May 2010 02:08

No no

I meant asking for something if say you beat like multiple levels. Like say 4-1 4-2 3-2 5-1

Im not saying asking for chunks. I mean more like a couple of shards. Most shards are easy to get. Lol thats probably what id be going for if i was not helping someone.

Lol i also am not saying i make them give me something. More like say "hey if your not going to use XXX ore and you have some to spare" kinda thought. So say if i help you beat multiple levels you can hit stock pile thomas and pick them up while im kill myself to get to soul form.

I dont want to mess with a new player. Just if they are doing a dex build the probably will not use darkmoon or moonlight stones.

Last edited on 03 May 2010 02:08 by TargetDestroyed Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Angelonedge 03 May 2010 02:11

unless they're going for the platinum trophy, if so they'll use all stones they can get. Also it's my experience that new players are experimenting. So they'll make all kinds of weapons using all kinds of stones to try them out. By either thier NG+ or next character they're not as virgin to the game and probably won't need any help.

EDIT: I understand that you don't want to mess with them, which is nice of you, I'm not saying you're asking for a fee to help out. I'm just stating my views about it and I think that unless the either offer to give something or just give you something as a thank you, you shouldn't ask for anything. Basically think about what you would have done as a new player. Did you use all your stones making different things? Didn't you have billions of questions? How would you feel if someone asked to be compensated in a way for helping? Wouldn't you think that being a blue and the souls/tendency that you got be enough?

Last edited on 03 May 2010 02:15 by Angelonedge Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Hakujin 03 May 2010 02:17

It all depends, you could always ask…….if you do enough levels where they pick up a bunch of "useless" ores, then there's no reason why you shouldn't ask. If I see them throwing away a bunch ores I'll just pick them up. But I can see why you're asking this question. It does beg the question; is asking within etiquette?

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Kinda Orange 03 May 2010 02:31

People will ask you for help even though you haven't seen them from soul signs. I use to ask people with red eye stones to help me then duel.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 03 May 2010 03:05

Lol im not a trophy guy so i dont have them all. I really dont have a desire to get them either. I play. If i make a +5 weapon cool. If not so be it.

I got this game the first day it came out in north america. I learned 90% of this game by hours and hours and hours of trial and error. And mostly dieing.
There was not fancy wiki for me. I learned the tower knight, armored spider, etc boss patterns by doing it a million times. The 10% was after i found out people pvp. So i made a dex build and found out how to get pure bladestones. Stuff like that.

I guess when ever i had a question i found it myself. I did get the deluxe edition so i had the guide that came with it. So that helped.
There were not real veteran players. No 120 level pvp.
Once in the early days i got invaded buy a guy using a pick axe.
Used to get invaded everywhere any level any where. There were not "typical" invaded levels. The first time i was invaded i think i wet myself.
There was no dual katana push lock, no meridian hammer stun lock. Just people playing the game and figuring it all out. Ahhh the good old days.

I never even made a character build until i came to the wiki and found out people pvp at 120. I just kinda randomly put points in and played the game. I screwed up upgrading weapons even with my guide. I experimented with spells.

Am i saying i dont like questions or helping people no. Its just i dont like answering unending questions spending more time typing than i do playing. Question like what this hardstone stuff. Or what weapon did you use? Wow where did you get that. What do you mean +5? Adding people to my friends list helping them play 4 levels then they never want to play again.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Angelonedge 03 May 2010 03:11

I understand what you're saying. I guess it just goes with playing the game. Here's a helpful tip have more than one game your playing. If someone randomly out of the blue starts asking 20 questions or wants me to help out I'll help with maybe one or two levels but if I get the idea that he wants me to play the ENTIRE game with him/her, I'll politely tell them I've got to get off. Make up some excuse (I'm married with kids so family is always an option) or tell them a friend has requested that I play a game with them/play a different game. It can be frustrating, and I'm not sure but isn't there a way to only get messages from people in your friends list? I believe there is an option like that for the online system in general.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

esdren 03 May 2010 03:40

i try to help out as I can. Or if unable to do so, try to be as polite as possible. All msg's get a response though.

Now that Ive been PvPing a good deal more Ive run into a lot of guys with subpar builds or using random weaps. After I beat them down Ill usually offer a bit of advice, such as with weapon buffs encumberance and rolling etc. Most times Ive gotten positive responses, though some try to start talking trash about how cheap I was that I killed their guy with a tower sheild and brushwood in 4 swings with my cursed kilij.

The only guy who i wasnt really nice with was one guy I helped in 1-4 who begged me via psn msg for over an hour trying to trade for my weapons. After the first 5 msg's I just stopped responding until he finally told me to F off since I was being selfish

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Angelonedge 03 May 2010 04:22

LMAO! He begged you for the weapons you were using/preferred and then got mad when you wouldn't give them up? I guess you could have duped them to him, but still that's like saying "Hey I like your tattoo could you rip it off you arm and give it to me?"

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Ilkar 03 May 2010 14:27

I had a funny opportunity to deal with a 'New' player last night, or perhaps you could call them a fan…
I had a really good duel against a BBS user, he put up a very good fight but I won in the end, and he sent me a PSN message to say he was impressed. I replied and we got talking about PvP and he said 'Gee, you sure know a lot about the PvP in this game, almost as much as that guy Ilkar from the wiki.'

I lol'd.

---

DSWiki Admin, Site Administrator,
Demon's Souls EU Strategy Guide Author, Namco Bandai Community Team Member;
That guy with the Kilij in all those Tournaments.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 04 May 2010 02:03

I just look at it like this.

I will help with levels when ever possible. I have no problem helping people.

Lol its the questions. I guess i like to point people to this wiki. Have guides, weapon upgrade paths, anything you you could ever want to know. Then if you cant find an answer to a question take 3 min make an account and post.

For the most part everyone who posts on a regular basis is helpful and understanding.

So i figure yes i could tell a new player how to upgrade weapons by explaining to beat the flamelurker, talk to black smith etc. Or refer them to the wiki. They will then have all that information plus all weapon upgrade paths, how people use these weapons, armor and equipment suggestions.

I guess in my mind that is more helpful than me answering one question and leaving room for more.

As far as the giving of ores…. I look at it like this. My guess is a good majority of people will start to make a character then find out a new piece of information and start over again. So i really dont think that i would say be hurting their chances about getting trophies as they more than likely will make multiple characters. So if i ask for a couple of shards of XXXX for help on multiple levels I believe it helps us both. I get the shards i want they get a few levels beat nice and easy. And a personal black phantom guard.
It seems often just by seeing a veteran player a new player will start over. A few of you out there must have had a new player watch you destroy a level kill a black phantom and not even get hurt at a boss. Then you get a message from them "wow your awesome" "how did you do all that" "ohh man im starting over im gonna do that"

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

nobloodnoguts 04 May 2010 09:05

I created a new character (sub 20), and was going through clearing the levels as a body. In 3-1 I summoned a blue with no multi sessions but thought what the hell.
At the area with the heavy armour, I picked it up but was overladen so some of it dropped back down. Whilst I was sorting out my inventory, he picked it up and kept it! I let it go cos I'd never wear it anyway but nevertheless made me smile.
He didn't kill anything in the world apart from a stray beggar, and just followed me around, including watching me kill the floating boss lady.
I gave him a C (normally I just S everything). He psn'd me and said thanks. Wasn't sure if he was being sarcastic!

On my other character, I have occasionally asked if they had any faintstone chunks to trade, after we have cleared the level. 90% though the answer is I have only a few shards. Seems like everyone hates world 5 (including me).

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

MeMcDee 04 May 2010 19:06

I also put this in the thread PVP, but I here goes:
I am not the best player by any means. I've played for a long time, really messed up in the beginning and now with a new character really trying to get the world tendency stuff (2 more white 2 go-which I do have with another character), finally got my foe's ring, have friend's ring, etc. I also got the Monk's head wrap when a player died before getting to the Old Monk. I've also gone in as a Blue Phantom to help others, haven't invade yet, but have won a few and lost more when invaded.
That's just to tell you a little about me.

Recently I went in as a Blue Phantom at the Tower Knight (easy boss since I had Soul Ray). The other guy just watched me kill him (he asked me if TK was hard to kill and how to do it, since he was a knight I said he had to go for the feet, watch the sword and shield). Instead he decided to just watch me. No problem, easy kill. He ends up giving me a low score.

Afterwards, I said if he needed help he could look up this wiki, or ask me a question, but said I didn't know everything-he had already been asking me how to cast spells, where to get certain things, etc. Then he started asking me if I could loan him my trophy weapons, upgrades and such so he could get the trophies. I told him I'd just started this newer character and that any special weapons I had were with another character which was at too high a level. Then he leveled up his character, but amazingly was getting all kinds of items really fast-he had all the rings, most of the trophy weapons and all the upgrades except for 2, and hadn't even finished his first game. It's possible, but not probable that he did that all himself.

The point is, I don't mind helping anyone and do appreciate it when someone helps me, but what fun is this game if someone doesn't even try to get this stuff at all and just wants someone to give it to them. I figure this guy had to be new as he said, since he didn't have the trophies, but he was cranking them out like crazy.

So I figure when I say help or someone else says help then they mean help, not do it all for me.

I've also been beaten by an invader only to be asked for some ores, and I was a new player. Go figure.

Cleaned up your double post. - Ilkar

Last edited on 04 May 2010 19:23 by Ilkar Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

Ilkar 04 May 2010 19:25

Don't worry, I'll sort it out.

All I can say in terms of dealing with new players is point them in the direction of the wiki. I can't think of any more funny stories off of the top of my head.

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DSWiki Admin, Site Administrator,
Demon's Souls EU Strategy Guide Author, Namco Bandai Community Team Member;
That guy with the Kilij in all those Tournaments.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

onlotus 04 May 2010 19:40

I don't mind helping anybody that is friendly. I will help anybody but if they give me a low grade they will catch some hate mail and I block them. I block people that use scrapping spear and glitches. I don't know why but it's not that big a deal if somebody uses soulsucks on me. I feel if they catch me that good my hats off to them. But as far as helping people I am all about giving for some reason. I guess because it makes me feel like Santa Claus. I have a character that sits on soul level 17 with 99 legendarily hero souls, 99 legendarily soldier souls, with +5 fatal and sharp weapons. In a matter of 30 mins you can have a 120 dex character after talking to me. lol

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120 PVP Builds Play On Player

Last edited on 04 May 2010 19:41 by onlotus Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 05 May 2010 01:26

"Glitching" is the practice of a player exploiting faults in a video game's programming to achieve tasks normally impossible if the game's script runs as intended

99 of xxxx souls +5 weapons at soul level 17. Sounds like a task normally impossible if the game's script runs as intended. Unless you beat the NG++++++++ at level 17 to have amassed that amount.

So by your logic would you have to block yourself??

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

onlotus 05 May 2010 12:39

I hate to say this but your the type of person I would block.

p.s.=when i said glitches i was talking about pvp glitches not game glitches. so no i would not block myself want to see why?

http://demonssouls.wikidot.com/forum/t-238315/demon-s-souls-secrets#post-770782

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120 PVP Builds Play On Player

Last edited on 05 May 2010 12:46 by onlotus Show more

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 06 May 2010 01:39

I know you would block me. I use acid cloud and scraping spear. On my dex build i use both.

A glitch is a glitch period.
I doubt the game developers wanted a SL 17 to have all that gear. So a glitch. It may not be a pvp exploit. But its still a game exploit = glitch.

But I can see this is one of those situations where the usual disagreement situation happens.

I have a different opinion than you therefore wrong. Most people can justify anything that they use to be ok.

You state in your own words:
"I love the secret glitches of Demon’s Souls. I do not use pvp glitches but I do use glitches that help me in the game. Here are some I use in the game and links to show you how they are done."

Again in your own words:
"I block people that use scrapping spear and glitches"

So you state that you use glitches.. you also state that you block people that use glitches. So logically you would have to say
You knowingly use glitches…… you say you block people who glitch… you would block yourself. Unless you are a hypocrite.

I know but its not pvp glitching

Its like saying i have 3 apples and 4 oranges.
3 + 4 = 7

Yea but i meant to say red apples. So its different.
but 3 + 4 still = 7

So pvp or game glitch its still a glitch.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

onlotus 06 May 2010 13:44

Why don't you send me your psn cause I want to make sure I block you. I glitch the game to help myself and others. Not to do harm to anyone. That is the difference. If you really want to understand what I am saying listen. Are you listening? Good keep listening.

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120 PVP Builds Play On Player

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

TargetDestroyed 06 May 2010 21:21

Ok first off i cant hear you at all.
I can read what you type but cant hear you.

Second im not debating the fact you use the glitches for good or evil

Im simply stating that you glitch plain and simple. Ill type it again so you can read it
You glitch plain and simple.

So for good or bad it is still a glitch. It is still unintended occurrence in the game that was not planned programed in.

I would like to ask other players if they think having 99 of the most powerful souls is and "advantage". Yes it does not harm any one but still is and advantage that other people do not have access to. Or the knowledge how.

Also i would ask. Can you for 100 percent certainty say that all of your "gifts" to other players have been used properly? I mean say a level 20 person you gave a +5 uchi to. That person decides to stay at level 20 and pvp and destroy everyone. So yes your "gift" was not intended to harm anyone but in the end it did.

And my final example is this.

In the post: I met a devil

You showed this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BIwlT_6-9Kg

In this video you "glitched" IN PVP.

In post: Demons souls secrets you said this was a glitch
No Dying
When you die, hold the PS button down and quit game before it auto-saves. When you restart your game you should be somewhere before you died and you will still have your Souls.

So in this pvp video it shows that you used, in your own words, a glitch in PVP. You used the glitch of no dying. So how did that not harm another player??? You left a duel.

So how much more proof do you need that you glitch??
You did it in pvp and you said you didnt??

No only that you promoted to just quit when you cant win or someone uses tactics that "you" not everyone else thinks are cheap.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

N1fighter 06 May 2010 23:09

In the video, I assume that onlotus is the player who got invaded. The red phantom was using soulsuck right?

My question is, how did the player get the soulsuck animation so fast? Was it a glitch?

IF the soulsuck was a glitch, are you (as a player) just going to sit there and take it? I sure wouldn't, I would pull the chord. In my opinion and most unlikelyy scenario, if I went into a fight and the other person somehow summoned lightning and a tornado and a hurricane and an earthquake to strike me at the same time during a cloudless day (something nature did not intend), then I would run my ass off out of the fight. It was a dirty glitch and I don't blame //onlotus //for quitting a fight.

Targetdestroyed, you wrote regarding the 99 legendary souls, "Yes it does not harm any one but still is and advantage that other people do not have access to. Or the knowledge how.". The knowledge is out on the internet on how to dupe 99 of the most powerful souls. If somebody decides to use that information, they aren't hurting anybody because 'anybody' can learn from the knowledge bank on the internet. Duping isn't hurting anybody, just using a glitch to gain an advantage that anybody can use.

Likewise, a backstab glitch or the moving firestorm glitch is in the same category. It was not meant by the programmers, but these glitches are used. There are places on the internet that tell you how to use it (knowledge bank) but it is up to the person to decide to use the glitches.

I understand onlotus' opinion in that he/she/it doesn't like when players use glitches during PVP, it just seems…malicious. But…it happens. You can always quit, die, give up. What is the worst that happens? Grumbling and going to play a few levels to get back your soul levels?

Both of you have your opinions and I doubt they will change on the forum, why not just respectfully disagree and not play each other?

Also, onlotus feels like Santa Claus, do we all really want to bug onlotus for being like Old St. Nick? I'm Jewish and I think it is cute. <—- Half hearted joke to end my post.

Re: How do you "Veteran" players handle "New" players

onlotus 08 May 2010 23:12

Yes it was a glitched soulsuck like a running firestorm which is also a pvp glitch.

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120 PVP Builds Play On Player

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